Pat Tillman was not a pro athlete

mark_chalifoux · April 18th, 2005, 11:27 PM

Most pro athletes are defined by what they do. Michael Jordan was a basketball player; Wayne Gretzky was a hockey player, etc. Pat Tillman won’t be remembered as a football player or as a pro athlete, like Simeon Rice and Ty Law. Pat was a man who played football. And despite what he said, he was...
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JGAC · April 19th, 2005, 09:00 AM

He is not a pro athlete just because he was in the army, nevermind the fact that he didnt take the easy way out.

Murphys Law · April 19th, 2005, 10:18 AM

Ted Williams was a pro athlete. Hall of famer Bob Feller, Paul Brown "Bear" Bryant, professional athletes all. The difference between them and Tillman?
They grew up in an age where service to ones country was the norm. It was a level of duty that they all felt they owed this nation.
Pat Tillmans service used to be the norm. But like many things this day in age it alas is no longer.
So yes I will compare Pat Tillman to the T.Os and the Barry Bonds, of the sporting world. I compare them not on the number of points scored, or dollars that could be made. But I will measure them on the scale of humanity and what they have given for others, and im afraid it will take a great many Moss's Mitchels' Iversons' Bonds' T.O's to equal the scale. But they were professional athletes all.

Im right your wrong and thats

Ishkur · April 19th, 2005, 01:00 PM

You know, unless we actually decide to legislate unethical behavior, there's not really a hell of a lot we can do about the Vince Carters and Barry Bonds in the world. It takes all kinds in a society as free as this one, and if they don't feel they have to commit selfless acts like Tillman did, they have every right to do so. Bitching about it's not going to change anything.

Besides, I'm still full of fence-straddling conflict over this issue. I just can't decide if what Tillman did was noble and brave.......or incredibly stupid. Maybe if it was another war, I could think of him as a hero.

Rusty27 · April 19th, 2005, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishkur

You know, unless we actually decide to legislate unethical behavior, there's not really a hell of a lot we can do about the Vince Carters and Barry Bonds in the world. It takes all kinds in a society as free as this one, and if they don't feel they have to commit selfless acts like Tillman did, they have every right to do so. Bitching about it's not going to change anything.

Besides, I'm still full of fence-straddling conflict over this issue. I just can't decide if what Tillman did was noble and brave.......or incredibly stupid. Maybe if it was another war, I could think of him as a hero.

Oh,it was brave.He died in Afghanistan.Maybe you were thinking of Iraq.

KP · April 19th, 2005, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishkur

You know, unless we actually decide to legislate unethical behavior, there's not really a hell of a lot we can do about the Vince Carters and Barry Bonds in the world. It takes all kinds in a society as free as this one, and if they don't feel they have to commit selfless acts like Tillman did, they have every right to do so. Bitching about it's not going to change anything.

Besides, I'm still full of fence-straddling conflict over this issue. I just can't decide if what Tillman did was noble and brave.......or incredibly stupid. Maybe if it was another war, I could think of him as a hero.

That is stupid. What difference does it make whether you approve of the reason for the war or not?

Are you saying that if you had approved of the war you would have the balls to drop what you're doing to serve your country? But because you didn't approve you won't bother?

He felt compelled to do what he did for his own reasons. He should be applauded for simply deciding to serve his country.

As for people like you, like you said, it takes all kinds....

BtownJay · April 19th, 2005, 04:15 PM

However Pat Tillman does not deserve any more credit than anyone else that died for his/her country.

Rusty27 · April 19th, 2005, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BtownJay

However Pat Tillman does not deserve any more credit than anyone else that died for his/her country.

Very true. They are all heroes.
KP is right too.The troops didn't start the Iraqi war.Bush did.
So even if Tillman died in Iraq,he is still a hero.

Ishkur · April 21st, 2005, 04:52 PM

No, what I'm saying is that for someone as noble-spirited as he is, dying in Afghanistan is a bit of a bummer. It would've been much more heroic if he had died in a WWII type conflict.....y'know...actually DEFENDING America. That's something we can be proud of, that we can hang our hats on and shed a tear for.

But as it was.....he died.....fighting someone who was not America's enemy, for reasons unclear as none of the wars fought since 911 have made America any safer.

Such a sad waste of a good life. He deserved a far more awesome war to die in than that.

lambeau_leap · April 21st, 2005, 11:22 PM

Not to go too deeply into politics, but if you don't believe the wars we have fought since 911 have kept you safe, you need to take a closer look at those wars. As someone who is helping to keep you safe, I take great offense.

KP · April 22nd, 2005, 12:22 AM

The man was pissed off over what happened to his country. So, he quit his job and joined the military. He made the decision, the choice, to defend his country any way he could.

lambeau, you should take great offense from ignorant idiots like Ishkur. People like him only have a self-centered agenda. He has shown his ego and pride many times on this board. People like him will never understand nor appreciate people like Tillman.

Ishkur · April 22nd, 2005, 02:57 AM

Keep me safe? ....from who, exactly? ze germans?

and KP: I take great offense to you thinking that I will never understand nor appreciate people like Tillman. On the contrary, I honour his selflessness too much to just have it been thrown away like that in a meaningless conflict. I want his life--and his death--to MEAN something. That goes beyond just enlisting and dying. There's got to be CONVICTION. There's got to be INTENT. You just stopped thinking at the "join the army" part and forgot that the act of doing that is quite meaningless if there is no constructive purpose behind its employment. Tillman did not give his life for you. He gave his life for men who neither cared nor appreciated his value. He died because these men decided his life is not worth as much as their jobs, their reputations or their financial security.

He deserved much more than that. He de--whoa! I have a self-centred agenda? ....Pray tell: what is it, exactly? I'd really like to know.

Rusty27 · April 22nd, 2005, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishkur

No, what I'm saying is that for someone as noble-spirited as he is, dying in Afghanistan is a bit of a bummer. It would've been much more heroic if he had died in a WWII type conflict.....y'know...actually DEFENDING America. That's something we can be proud of, that we can hang our hats on and shed a tear for.

But as it was.....he died.....fighting someone who was not America's enemy, for reasons unclear

April 18th, 2005, 11:27 PM	#1
mark_chalifoux Loyalist Join Date: 07-02-2004 Posts: 305 Tournaments Joined: 0 Tournament Wins: 0	Pat Tillman was not a pro athlete Most pro athletes are defined by what they do. Michael Jordan was a basketball player; Wayne Gretzky was a hockey player, etc. Pat Tillman won’t be remembered as a football player or as a pro athlete, like Simeon Rice and Ty Law. Pat was a man who played football. And despite what he said, he was... Full Article

April 19th, 2005, 09:00 AM	#2
JGAC the fish is back Join Date: 05-09-2003 Location: North End, Boston Posts: 6,079 Tournaments Joined: 0 Tournament Wins: 0	He is not a pro athlete just because he was in the army, nevermind the fact that he didnt take the easy way out. __________________ Shane:You would hope we could at least spell the fucking sport correctly.

April 19th, 2005, 10:18 AM	#3
Murphys Law T Rider Join Date: 03-21-2005 Posts: 115 Tournaments Joined: 0 Tournament Wins: 0	Ted Williams was a pro athlete. Hall of famer Bob Feller, Paul Brown "Bear" Bryant, professional athletes all. The difference between them and Tillman? They grew up in an age where service to ones country was the norm. It was a level of duty that they all felt they owed this nation. Pat Tillmans service used to be the norm. But like many things this day in age it alas is no longer. So yes I will compare Pat Tillman to the T.Os and the Barry Bonds, of the sporting world. I compare them not on the number of points scored, or dollars that could be made. But I will measure them on the scale of humanity and what they have given for others, and im afraid it will take a great many Moss's Mitchels' Iversons' Bonds' T.O's to equal the scale. But they were professional athletes all. Im right your wrong and thats __________________ Murphys Law

April 22nd, 2005, 12:22 AM	#11
KP blank Join Date: 07-08-2002 Posts: 1,988 Tournaments Joined: 0 Tournament Wins: 0	The man was pissed off over what happened to his country. So, he quit his job and joined the military. He made the decision, the choice, to defend his country any way he could. lambeau, you should take great offense from ignorant idiots like Ishkur. People like him only have a self-centered agenda. He has shown his ego and pride many times on this board. People like him will never understand nor appreciate people like Tillman. __________________ It's a RANT DADDY world.....and we're all just livin' in it!

April 19th, 2005, 01:00 PM	#4
Ishkur Crazed Fan Join Date: 12-27-2003 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 438 Tournaments Joined: 0 Tournament Wins: 0	You know, unless we actually decide to legislate unethical behavior, there's not really a hell of a lot we can do about the Vince Carters and Barry Bonds in the world. It takes all kinds in a society as free as this one, and if they don't feel they have to commit selfless acts like Tillman did, they have every right to do so. Bitching about it's not going to change anything. Besides, I'm still full of fence-straddling conflict over this issue. I just can't decide if what Tillman did was noble and brave.......or incredibly stupid. Maybe if it was another war, I could think of him as a hero.

April 21st, 2005, 04:52 PM	#9
Ishkur Crazed Fan Join Date: 12-27-2003 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 438 Tournaments Joined: 0 Tournament Wins: 0	No, what I'm saying is that for someone as noble-spirited as he is, dying in Afghanistan is a bit of a bummer. It would've been much more heroic if he had died in a WWII type conflict.....y'know...actually DEFENDING America. That's something we can be proud of, that we can hang our hats on and shed a tear for. But as it was.....he died.....fighting someone who was not America's enemy, for reasons unclear as none of the wars fought since 911 have made America any safer. Such a sad waste of a good life. He deserved a far more awesome war to die in than that.

April 21st, 2005, 11:22 PM	#10
lambeau_leap Lambeau_Leap Join Date: 04-15-2005 Location: Ewa Beach, HI Posts: 1 Tournaments Joined: 0 Tournament Wins: 0	Not to go too deeply into politics, but if you don't believe the wars we have fought since 911 have kept you safe, you need to take a closer look at those wars. As someone who is helping to keep you safe, I take great offense.

April 22nd, 2005, 02:57 AM	#12
Ishkur Crazed Fan Join Date: 12-27-2003 Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 438 Tournaments Joined: 0 Tournament Wins: 0	Keep me safe? ....from who, exactly? ze germans? and KP: I take great offense to you thinking that I will never understand nor appreciate people like Tillman. On the contrary, I honour his selflessness too much to just have it been thrown away like that in a meaningless conflict. I want his life--and his death--to MEAN something. That goes beyond just enlisting and dying. There's got to be CONVICTION. There's got to be INTENT. You just stopped thinking at the "join the army" part and forgot that the act of doing that is quite meaningless if there is no constructive purpose behind its employment. Tillman did not give his life for you. He gave his life for men who neither cared nor appreciated his value. He died because these men decided his life is not worth as much as their jobs, their reputations or their financial security. He deserved much more than that. He de--whoa! I have a self-centred agenda? ....Pray tell: what is it, exactly? I'd really like to know.